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OK, someone recently asked me what Samsonite Lego is.
LEGO, as we all know was founded in Denmark. By the mid 1950's, it was
sold throughout the Scandanavian countries of Europe. In 1956 it
started selling in West Germany, Europes largest market. By the early
1960's TLG wanted to expand to the USA and Canada. However, this was
such a large market for a small company like TLG to get into, that it
formed a licensing partnership with the Samsonite Corporation of Denver
Colorado. The license (as was just stated by Anders Isaksson of Sweden)
was for 99 years, although TLG purchased back the license in 1972. So
between 1961 and 1972 all US Lego boxes said "LEGO by Samsonite". The
Canadian Samsonite connection, if memory serves me correctly, lasted a
lot longer -- from 1962 to 1986.
For many years, Samsonite made different sets than TLG Europe. Even the
numbers were different. I believe in the later years some of the sets
did match what was produced by TLG Europe.
The service packs were an interesting exception. In the early years the
parts pack numbers were the same, but the Samsonite boxes were larger,
and usually contained more parts. Then in the later years, the service
packs were totally different in number.
In my opinion 2 of the most beautiful and interesting sets ever produced
by Lego were the Junior Constructor (#717) and the Town Plan (#725).
These were both produced from 1961-65 in some very large (and very
heavy) thick cardboard boxes.
Starting in 1973, TLG took over and the USA Lego headquarters were moved
to Enfield Connecticut.
Gary Istok
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Wow! Thanks for the info. I hadn't ever heard of this!
Ciao!
--
In science it often happens that scientists say, 'You know that's a really good argument; my position is mistaken,' and then they actually change their minds and you never hear that old view from them again. They really do it. It doesn't happen as often as it should, because scientists are human and change is sometimes painful. But it happens every day. I cannot recall the last time something like that happened in politics or religion.
-- Carl Sagan, 1987 CSICOP keynote address
The Doctor What: Not that 'who' guy http://docwhat.gerf.org/
docwhat@gerf.org (finger docwhat@gerf.org for PGP key)
KF6VNC
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Gary Istok <gistok@umich.edu> wrote in article
<37BC1D46.5C36F5E5@umich.edu>...
> OK, someone recently asked me what Samsonite Lego is.
> 1960's TLG wanted to expand to the USA and Canada. However, this was
> such a large market for a small company like TLG to get into, that it
> formed a licensing partnership with the Samsonite Corporation of Denver
> The
> Canadian Samsonite connection, if memory serves me correctly, lasted a
> lot longer -- from 1962 to 1986.
For curiousity's sake, I live about a mile and a half from the building
where the Canadian Samsonite Lego was distributed back then. (Stratford,
ON)
My mind wanders every time I drive by the building. :)
Regards,
Allan
--
Expert Builder Website - The Megaproject Showcase
http://www.execulink.com/~apotome/expert.htm
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> 1960's TLG wanted to expand to the USA and Canada. However, this was
> such a large market for a small company like TLG to get into, that it
> formed a licensing partnership with the Samsonite Corporation of Denver
> Colorado.
I'm wondering how accurate that explanation is. Doesn't the U.S. have
particularly high import tariffs[1]? So is it possible that Lego would have
been deemed shipping through U.S. import duties too expensive compared to
making the Lego in the country? The North American market was certainly
large enough for them to justify the cost of setting up manufacturing in
that continent, and if they were Europe-wide before that then surely they
weren't _that_ small. Is it also possible that having the product made by a
U.S. company (i.e. "LEGO by Samsonite") would also avoid further (or same)
duties slapped on by the U.S. government?
This is all idle speculation, of course. I don't profess to knowing in
detail U.S. trade policies of the last 30 years (or even what % of world
Lego sales were in N. America [2]), I just remember hearing that U.S. trade
policies protected its own industries particularly aggressively (which is
fair enough. It's a lucky country that has the resources to allow it to rely
on local product [4] ).
Paul
http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shuttle/5168/
[1] I think that's what it's called, that amount that the government whacks
onto an imported item (to "protect" the local product). Import duty?
[2] Actually, does anybody here know roughly what proportion of Lego sold
(say, last year) in the world was sold in North America?
[3] Does anybody know why most Lego sets have a different title outside the
U.S.? Did they just not bother to make them the same, or was it intentional?
(in other words: ALWAYS give the set #'s please!!!!)
[4] Is Best-Lock made in the U.S.? ;)
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I was always under the impression that a lot of European and other parts of the
world countries had very high tariffs as well. We have NAFTA (North American
Free trade Agreement) here that reduced a lot of the taxes, etc. between the US,
Mexico, and Canada. The disagreement, especially nowadays, is that US tariffs
are extremely low to most products/imports compared to the rest of the world.
The US is very dependent on imports, anything from video games to electronics to
Lego products to clothes, etc. A big player on this is China.
Going back to the issue, I am sure TLG saw it being in a better to position to
have a US firm initially do production, and see where it went. As we all know,
it was a hit! This also eliminates the taxes from importing products.
Scott Sanburn
--
Scott E. Sanburn
CADD Operator, CADD Systems Administrator
Affiliated Engineers, Inc. Ann Arbor, MI
Work Page:
http://www.aeieng.com/
Home Page:
http://www.geocities.com/~legoguy712/index.html
Lego Page:
http://www.geocities.com/~legoguy712/legoindex.html
“The more people I meet, the more I like my Lego collection.”
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Scott Edward Sanburn <ssanburn@aeieng.com> wrote in message
news:37BD9833.B2990CFE@aeieng.com...
> I was always under the impression that a lot of European and other parts • of the
> world countries had very high tariffs as well. We have NAFTA (North • American
> Free trade Agreement) here that reduced a lot of the taxes, etc. between • the US,
> Mexico, and Canada. The disagreement, especially nowadays, is that US • tariffs
> are extremely low to most products/imports compared to the rest of the • world.
> The US is very dependent on imports, anything from video games to • electronics to
> Lego products to clothes, etc. A big player on this is China.
NAFTA does only apply to the US, Canada and Mexico though...
And it is fairly recent. Who knows what the situation was 30 years ago when
Lego was making these decisions.
Also, the US does still impose substantial import tariffs when it suits
them, up to 100% of the cost of the product. (Read this to mean when
someone has pissed them off or imposed high tarriffs on US exports)
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Troy Cefaratti wrote:
> NAFTA does only apply to the US, Canada and Mexico though...
>
> And it is fairly recent. Who knows what the situation was 30 years ago when
> Lego was making these decisions.
I know, I was just trying to supplement tariffs and the like. I would have to
look at the 50-60's taxes, import, etc. to see for sure, but it most cases, it
is usually better for the company in question to have a US division, to get
around all those tariffs and taxes. I assume this is one of the reasons for TLG
(LG) to do this. I would also think of maybe some quality issues. I know I love
paying them! :)
> Also, the US does still impose substantial import tariffs when it suits
> them, up to 100% of the cost of the product. (Read this to mean when
> someone has pissed them off or imposed high tarriffs on US exports)
Yes, that falls under the Politics 101 category. Many nations do this, whether
its time of war, negotiations fail, etc. The US has some strange trade and
tariffs practices as it is. such as embargo's on Cuban products, because Cuba is
Communist, then we have open trade (Favored nation status) on countries like
Communist China?! (Chi-Comm's) Go figure!
Scott Sanburn
--
Scott E. Sanburn
CADD Operator, CADD Systems Administrator
Affiliated Engineers, Inc. Ann Arbor, MI
Work Page:
http://www.aeieng.com/
Home Page:
http://www.geocities.com/~legoguy712/index.html
Lego Page:
http://www.geocities.com/~legoguy712/legoindex.html
“The more people I meet, the more I like my Lego collection.”
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Scott Edward Sanburn wrote:
> Troy Cefaratti wrote:
>
> > NAFTA does only apply to the US, Canada and Mexico though...
> >
> > And it is fairly recent. Who knows what the situation was 30 years ago when
> > Lego was making these decisions.
>
> I know, I was just trying to supplement tariffs and the like. I would have to
> look at the 50-60's taxes, import, etc. to see for sure, but it most cases, it
> is usually better for the company in question to have a US division, to get
> around all those tariffs and taxes. I assume this is one of the reasons for TLG
> (LG) to do this. I would also think of maybe some quality issues. I know I love
> paying them! :)
>
> > Also, the US does still impose substantial import tariffs when it suits
> > them, up to 100% of the cost of the product. (Read this to mean when
> > someone has pissed them off or imposed high tarriffs on US exports)
>
> Yes, that falls under the Politics 101 category. Many nations do this, whether
> its time of war, negotiations fail, etc. The US has some strange trade and
> tariffs practices as it is. such as embargo's on Cuban products, because Cuba is
> Communist, then we have open trade (Favored nation status) on countries like
> Communist China?! (Chi-Comm's) Go figure!
Like the recent decision on lamb imports. The thing there is:
The us lamb producers can vote in the comming election and the australian ones cant so the us ones
win out.
--
Jonathan Wilson
wilsonj@xoommail.com
http://members.xoom.com/wilsonj/
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Scott Edward Sanburn wrote:
> I didn't hear about this one? What happened?
>
> Scott S.
>
> Jonathan Wilson wrote:
> > Like the recent decision on lamb imports. The thing there is:
> > The us lamb producers can vote in the comming election and the australian ones cant so the us ones
> > win out.
>
>
> --
> Scott E. Sanburn
> CADD Operator, CADD Systems Administrator
> Affiliated Engineers, Inc. Ann Arbor, MI
>
> Work Page:
> http://www.aeieng.com/
> Home Page:
> http://www.geocities.com/~legoguy712/index.html
> Lego Page:
> http://www.geocities.com/~legoguy712/legoindex.html
>
> “The more people I meet, the more I like my Lego collection.”
The us imposed tarrifs on imports of australian lamb.
--
Jonathan Wilson
wilsonj@xoommail.com
http://members.xoom.com/wilsonj/
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The US has some strange trade and
> tariffs practices as it is. such as embargo's on Cuban products, because • Cuba is
> Communist, then we have open trade (Favored nation status) on countries • like
> Communist China?! (Chi-Comm's) Go figure!
I think that the main difference here is that China is a HUGE market that US
Companies want to get into, whereas Cuba is not. And since big companies
pay big money for lobbyists, they usually get what they want....
I htink this is getting a bit off topic for general though...
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Not when the Chi-Comm's give you millions of dollars in campaign contributions
for the election and nuclear missile technology!
Scott S.
Troy Cefaratti wrote:
>
> The US has some strange trade and
> > tariffs practices as it is. such as embargo's on Cuban products, because • Cuba is
> > Communist, then we have open trade (Favored nation status) on countries • like
> > Communist China?! (Chi-Comm's) Go figure!
>
> I think that the main difference here is that China is a HUGE market that US
> Companies want to get into, whereas Cuba is not. And since big companies
> pay big money for lobbyists, they usually get what they want....
>
> I htink this is getting a bit off topic for general though...
--
Scott E. Sanburn
CADD Operator, CADD Systems Administrator
Affiliated Engineers, Inc. Ann Arbor, MI
Work Page:
http://www.aeieng.com/
Home Page:
http://www.geocities.com/~legoguy712/index.html
Lego Page:
http://www.geocities.com/~legoguy712/legoindex.html
“The more people I meet, the more I like my Lego collection.”
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Jonathan Wilson <wilsonj@xoommail.com> wrote:
> Like the recent decision on lamb imports. The thing there is:
> The us lamb producers can vote in the comming election and the australian ones cant so the us ones
> win out.
Oh, I don't know.
The Australian lamb producers could spend some of their money to buy
votes/politicians just like other foreign groups do.
--
The parts you want and nothing else?
http://jaba.dtrh.com/ - Just Another Brick Auction
Why pay eBay? Run your own LEGO auctions for free!
http://www.guarded-inn.com/bricks/ (still in Beta)
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I'm sure there are a lot of nuances that went into this decision. The Danish
company was only into its' 8th year of exporting it's product when it entered
the US market. As to whether tariffs were a consideration, I'm sure they were.
Even the sets that Samsonite produced contained a lot of parts made in Denmark.
I have Samsonite parts packs that say on the box "Contents Made in Denmark". I
think what happened was the basic bricks were made in the USA, but everything
else (windows, doors, signs, trees, cars & trucks, literature, etc) was produced
in Denmark. In 1961, when LEGO entered the USA, TLG was still a growing
company, far from being the billion dollar corporation that it is today.
Gary Istok
Paul Baulch wrote:
> > 1960's TLG wanted to expand to the USA and Canada. However, this was
> > such a large market for a small company like TLG to get into, that it
> > formed a licensing partnership with the Samsonite Corporation of Denver
> > Colorado.
>
> I'm wondering how accurate that explanation is. Doesn't the U.S. have
> particularly high import tariffs[1]? So is it possible that Lego would have
> been deemed shipping through U.S. import duties too expensive compared to
> making the Lego in the country? The North American market was certainly
> large enough for them to justify the cost of setting up manufacturing in
> that continent, and if they were Europe-wide before that then surely they
> weren't _that_ small. Is it also possible that having the product made by a
> U.S. company (i.e. "LEGO by Samsonite") would also avoid further (or same)
> duties slapped on by the U.S. government?
> This is all idle speculation, of course. I don't profess to knowing in
> detail U.S. trade policies of the last 30 years (or even what % of world
> Lego sales were in N. America [2]), I just remember hearing that U.S. trade
> policies protected its own industries particularly aggressively (which is
> fair enough. It's a lucky country that has the resources to allow it to rely
> on local product [4] ).
>
> Paul
> http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shuttle/5168/
>
> [1] I think that's what it's called, that amount that the government whacks
> onto an imported item (to "protect" the local product). Import duty?
> [2] Actually, does anybody here know roughly what proportion of Lego sold
> (say, last year) in the world was sold in North America?
> [3] Does anybody know why most Lego sets have a different title outside the
> U.S.? Did they just not bother to make them the same, or was it intentional?
> (in other words: ALWAYS give the set #'s please!!!!)
> [4] Is Best-Lock made in the U.S.? ;)
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Scott Edward Sanburn wrote:
> (snipped)
> The US has some strange trade and
> tariffs practices as it is. such as embargo's on Cuban products, because Cuba is
> Communist, then we have open trade (Favored nation status) on countries like
> Communist China?! (Chi-Comm's) Go figure!
>
> Scott Sanburn
Let's be real here! We still have a trade embargo against Cuba because we're still
miffed that they chose the USSR over *us* for their sugar daddy. Go ahead, try to
find that argument in any textbook :-)
Beth Reiten
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Beth,
While I kind of agree, let's remember that Castro parked several nuclear
missiles around 90 miles out of Florida, hence the embargo. I think it is just
resentment against Castro, the loony!
Scott S.
Beth Reiten wrote:
>
> Scott Edward Sanburn wrote:
>
> > (snipped)
>
> > The US has some strange trade and
> > tariffs practices as it is. such as embargo's on Cuban products, because Cuba is
> > Communist, then we have open trade (Favored nation status) on countries like
> > Communist China?! (Chi-Comm's) Go figure!
> >
> > Scott Sanburn
>
> Let's be real here! We still have a trade embargo against Cuba because we're still
> miffed that they chose the USSR over *us* for their sugar daddy. Go ahead, try to
> find that argument in any textbook :-)
> Beth Reiten
--
Scott E. Sanburn
CADD Operator, CADD Systems Administrator
Affiliated Engineers, Inc. Ann Arbor, MI
Work Page:
http://www.aeieng.com/
Home Page:
http://www.geocities.com/~legoguy712/index.html
Lego Page:
http://www.geocities.com/~legoguy712/legoindex.html
“The more people I meet, the more I like my Lego collection.”
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> [2] Actually, does anybody here know roughly what proportion of Lego sold
> (say, last year) in the world was sold in North America?
I'm going to guess anywhere from 35 to 45%. Though that is for all of the
Americas, which LEGO's US subsidiary is in charge of.
> [3] Does anybody know why most Lego sets have a different title outside the
> U.S.? Did they just not bother to make them the same, or was it intentional?
> (in other words: ALWAYS give the set #'s please!!!!)
The local affiliate is in charge of naming the set.
> [4] Is Best-Lock made in the U.S.? ;)
Good question. Either the U.S. or U.K., or maybe even China, though Best-Lock
is either an American or British company.
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