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When I get some time, I want to generate an entirely new HISTORY OF LEGO
WINDOWS document. But in the mean time, here are some brief
updates......
Gary Istok
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
LEGEND
CA= Cellulose Acetate - plastic used for windows from 1957-63.
ABS = Plastic used for windows from 1963-present.
Sills = The window sill underneath the window protrudes forward on all
early LEGO windows (except for the 1x6x3 picture window and the classic
door). Later, circa 1970 the sill was recessed so that it was nearly
flush with the surface of the window frame.
The 214 numbering system used for these windows matches the parts pack
numbers used from 1957-66. This also coincided with the numbers used
for European Dealer Windows & Door Boxes (214 1-10), where pieces were
sold individually from 1957 until the latter 1960's.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
214/1 (1x6x3 Large Window) - This window is available in CA in red or
white, and in ABS in red, white and yellow*.
214/2 (1x6x2 Large Window) - This window is available in CA (with sill
only) in red or white, and in ABS (with or without sill) in red and
white..
214/3 (1x6x2 shuttered window) - This window is available in CA (with
sill only) in red or white, and in ABS (with or without sill) in red and
white.
214/4 (1x4x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
in red or white, and in ABS (with or without sill) in red and white.
214/5 (1x3x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red and white, and ABS (without
sill) in red, white and blue**.
214/6 (1x2x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red, white and yellow***, and ABS
(without sill) in red, white, yellow, blue, black## and grey**.
Currently still in production in red, white, yellow, blue.
214/7 (1x1x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red and white, and ABS (without
sill) in red, white, yellow##, or black##.
214/8 (1x2x1 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red, white and yellow***, and ABS
(without sill) in red, white and yellow##.
214/9 (1x1x1 window) - This window is available in CA (without sill
only) in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red and white, and ABS
(without sill) in red, white and yellow##.
214/10 (1x2x3 door) - The classic door is available in CA in red or
white, and in ABS in red, white and yellow#. The right handed and left
handed doors are available for all colors and plastics.
* Available in Shell sets 325 and 648.
** Available in 80's train set.
*** Only available in Shell set 325.
# Available in many 60's - 70's sets.
## Available in 70's train sets.
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On Fri, 7 Jan 2000, Gary Istok (<38764639.1C68D50F@umich.edu>) wrote at
20:02:01
> 214/1 (1x6x3 Large Window) - This window is available in CA in red or
> 214/2 (1x6x2 Large Window) - This window is available in CA (with sill
> 214/3 (1x6x2 shuttered window) - This window is available in CA (with
> 214/4 (1x4x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> 214/5 (1x3x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> 214/6 (1x2x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> 214/7 (1x1x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> 214/8 (1x2x1 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> 214/9 (1x1x1 window) - This window is available in CA (without sill
> 214/10 (1x2x3 door) - The classic door is available in CA in red or
Ahh. Happy memories.
I could visualise each of these as I read. I had them all. In red and
white ABS. With and without sills. In fact I can remember the point at
which I noticed that the sills had gone.
Those were the days.
--
Tony Priestman
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Tony Priestman wrote:
> On Fri, 7 Jan 2000, Gary Istok (<38764639.1C68D50F@umich.edu>) wrote at
> 20:02:01
>
> > 214/1 (1x6x3 Large Window) - This window is available in CA in red or
> > 214/2 (1x6x2 Large Window) - This window is available in CA (with sill
> > 214/3 (1x6x2 shuttered window) - This window is available in CA (with
> > 214/4 (1x4x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> > 214/5 (1x3x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> > 214/6 (1x2x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> > 214/7 (1x1x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> > 214/8 (1x2x1 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> > 214/9 (1x1x1 window) - This window is available in CA (without sill
> > 214/10 (1x2x3 door) - The classic door is available in CA in red or
>
> Ahh. Happy memories.
>
> I could visualise each of these as I read. I had them all. In red and
> white ABS. With and without sills. In fact I can remember the point at
> which I noticed that the sills had gone.
>
> Those were the days.
> --
> Tony Priestman
Thanks Tony,
Glad I could add a little nostalgia to your day!
There is another variation to add to this mix. That is the 1x1x1, 1x1x2
and 1x2x1 windows, which came with and without the plastic "glass". The
without sill variety of these windows came in both (glass and glass-less)
styles.
And then there is another variation for the first year of LEGO windows -
1957. Windows made that year had complete studs on top (with LEGO
imprinted on top). After 1957, the studs had the "crater" look that they
still have today (with LEGO at the bottom of the depression). The 1957
LEGO window variety is very rare today.
Here's my short list of very rare LEGO windows:
Any 1957 variety windows and doors.
1x2x2 and 1x2x1 in yellow WITH SILLS. Only ever found in Shell set 325
from 1966.
1x2x2 and 1x1x2 in black (only found in 70's train sets).
1x2x2 in grey (only found in 7740 Intercity Train).
Gary Istok
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In lugnet.general, Gary R. Istok writes:
>
> Here's my short list of very rare LEGO windows:
>
> 1x2x2 and 1x1x2 in black (only found in 70's train sets).
These were also found in early '80s trains:
7727, 7730, and 7750 each came with two 1x2x2 windows; 7810 came with four. In
addition, 7750 came with four 1x1x2 windows.
Jeff
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Jeff Stembel wrote:
> In lugnet.general, Gary R. Istok writes:
> >
> > Here's my short list of very rare LEGO windows:
> >
> > 1x2x2 and 1x1x2 in black (only found in 70's train sets).
>
> These were also found in early '80s trains:
> 7727, 7730, and 7750 each came with two 1x2x2 windows; 7810 came with four. In
> addition, 7750 came with four 1x1x2 windows.
>
> Jeff
Thanks for the correction Jeff. As you can tell, I am not into LEGO trains!
I also left out the 1x3x2 blue window (also a very rare window), also from an 80's
train set.
The LEGO Train system has, as it appears, the rarest of all classic LEGO windows
(in yellow, black, blue and gray).
Gary Istok
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In lugnet.general, Gary R. Istok writes:
>
>
> Jeff Stembel wrote:
>
> > In lugnet.general, Gary R. Istok writes:
> > >
> > > Here's my short list of very rare LEGO windows:
> > >
> > > 1x2x2 and 1x1x2 in black (only found in 70's train sets).
> >
> > These were also found in early '80s trains:
> > 7727, 7730, and 7750 each came with two 1x2x2 windows; 7810 came with four.
> > In addition, 7750 came with four 1x1x2 windows.
> >
> > Jeff
>
> Thanks for the correction Jeff. As you can tell, I am not into LEGO trains!
No problem! Always glad to help!
>
> I also left out the 1x3x2 blue window (also a very rare window), also from an
> 80's train set.
Oops, I forgot that one, too! The set is 7760, FTR.
>
> The LEGO Train system has, as it appears, the rarest of all classic LEGO
> windows (in yellow, black, blue and gray).
Yeah, *early* train system. It is a real pain for those of us who want to get
some of the ultra-cool pieces they used. *sigh*
Jeff
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gistok@umich.edu (Gary Istok) wrote in <3879FD58.50B7BAB1@umich.edu>:
<snip>
> And then there is another variation for the first year of LEGO windows -
> 1957. Windows made that year had complete studs on top (with LEGO
> imprinted on top). After 1957, the studs had the "crater" look that they
> still have today (with LEGO at the bottom of the depression). The 1957
> LEGO window variety is very rare today.
Speaking of which - when did the 1x1 cylinders switch from having
complete studs to the crater look style? In the cylinders of course,
it's not actually a crater, it's actually an open hole.
The 1975 sets I have all had solid studs, but after that I'm not sure.
And why, I wonder? Certainly you can use the hole to push tubes
through, but that's not done all that frequently, and you could make
the same argument for having holes in the studs of bricks...
I'm reconstructing a lot of my older sets, and trying hard to find the
cylinders with solid studs to use on them where indicated. The 565
space landing,for example, has around 20 white cylinders, and
these are by far the hardest parts for me to locate. (In contrast,
I have handfulls of extra white cylinders with the hole through
the stud.)
If anyone has any extras of these in any color, let me know... :-)
-r'm
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On Tue, 11 Jan 2000, Remy Evard (<8EB7E4871evardmcsanlgov@lugnet.com>)
wrote at 04:27:45
>
> Speaking of which - when did the 1x1 cylinders switch from having
> complete studs to the crater look style? In the cylinders of course,
> it's not actually a crater, it's actually an open hole.
>
> The 1975 sets I have all had solid studs, but after that I'm not sure.
>
> And why, I wonder? Certainly you can use the hole to push tubes
> through, but that's not done all that frequently, and you could make
> the same argument for having holes in the studs of bricks...
It's probably the same reason as minifig heads changed. The proposed
reason is that it reduces the choking risk when small children swallow
them.
That doesn't explain why it wasn't done to 1x1x1 bricks, though.
--
Tony Priestman
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Remy Evard wrote:
> gistok@umich.edu (Gary Istok) wrote in <3879FD58.50B7BAB1@umich.edu>:
> <snip>
> > And then there is another variation for the first year of LEGO windows -
> > 1957. Windows made that year had complete studs on top (with LEGO
> > imprinted on top). After 1957, the studs had the "crater" look that they
> > still have today (with LEGO at the bottom of the depression). The 1957
> > LEGO window variety is very rare today.
>
> Speaking of which - when did the 1x1 cylinders switch from having
> complete studs to the crater look style? In the cylinders of course,
> it's not actually a crater, it's actually an open hole.
>
> The 1975 sets I have all had solid studs, but after that I'm not sure.
>
> And why, I wonder? Certainly you can use the hole to push tubes
> through, but that's not done all that frequently, and you could make
> the same argument for having holes in the studs of bricks...
>
> I'm reconstructing a lot of my older sets, and trying hard to find the
> cylinders with solid studs to use on them where indicated. The 565
> space landing,for example, has around 20 white cylinders, and
> these are by far the hardest parts for me to locate. (In contrast,
> I have handfulls of extra white cylinders with the hole through
> the stud.)
>
> If anyone has any extras of these in any color, let me know... :-)
>
> -r'm
The date they switched from the Type 2 cylinders (without hole) to Type 3 was
circa 1980. Someone with an intact Yellow Castle should check the yellow
cylinders to see if they have the holes or not.
The switch from Type 1 to Type 2 (remember Type 1 were the cylinders without
the tapered base, and without the hole on top) took place in the mid to late
1960's. I have a 1966 set 325 (Shell Station), and it came with the Type 2
cylinders, but I would have thought that the switch happened a little later.
Anyone who has a bunch of Type 1 bricks will remember them as not stacking
together very securely.
Gary Istok
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Gary Istok <gistok@umich.edu> wrote in message
news:387B5239.D3AADAD3@umich.edu...
>
> The date they switched from the Type 2 cylinders (without hole) to Type 3 • was
> circa 1980. Someone with an intact Yellow Castle should check the yellow
> cylinders to see if they have the holes or not.
I don't have mine handy, but I'm fairly certain that I recall the yellow
cylinders in this set having hollow studs. This makes sense; hollow studded
cylinders started appearing as early as 1977 (the same year the modern
minifig
debuted) in town sets, particularly in transparent colors.
> The switch from Type 1 to Type 2 (remember Type 1 were the cylinders • without
> the tapered base, and without the hole on top) took place in the mid to • late
> 1960's. I have a 1966 set 325 (Shell Station), and it came with the Type • 2
> cylinders, but I would have thought that the switch happened a little • later.
> Anyone who has a bunch of Type 1 bricks will remember them as not stacking
> together very securely.
>
> Gary Istok
>
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gistok@umich.edu (Gary Istok) wrote in <387B5239.D3AADAD3@umich.edu>:
<snip>
> The date they switched from the Type 2 cylinders (without hole) to Type
> 3 was circa 1980. Someone with an intact Yellow Castle should check the
> yellow cylinders to see if they have the holes or not.
Just popped the tower open on mine to check - they're solid. Type 2s.
And also, the 1x1x1 bricks with holes on the side are the older style
with square holes, not the currently bricks with round holes. They're
used as windows in the back tower, and look much better in this usage
than the ones with round holes would have.
> The switch from Type 1 to Type 2 (remember Type 1 were the cylinders
> without the tapered base, and without the hole on top) took place in the
> mid to late 1960's. I have a 1966 set 325 (Shell Station), and it came
> with the Type 2 cylinders, but I would have thought that the switch
> happened a little later. Anyone who has a bunch of Type 1 bricks will
> remember them as not stacking together very securely.
Aha, yes. That explains these other cylinders. Interesting. Thanks
for the info. (Bizarrely enough I remember playing with these as
a really young child and chewing on them, and I distinctly recall
the amount of biting effort it took to pop apart type 2 cylinders,
while the type 1s almost fell apart... strange thing to remember.)
Where do the names - Type 1, 2, 3 - come from? TLC, or from the
fan base?
-r'm
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Hello Remy, Thanks for checking! See below for comments.....
Remy Evard wrote:
> gistok@umich.edu (Gary Istok) wrote in <387B5239.D3AADAD3@umich.edu>:
> <snip>
> > The date they switched from the Type 2 cylinders (without hole) to Type
> > 3 was circa 1980. Someone with an intact Yellow Castle should check the
> > yellow cylinders to see if they have the holes or not.
>
> Just popped the tower open on mine to check - they're solid. Type 2s.
That would mean that the cylinders without the holes were made as late as
1982.
>
>
> And also, the 1x1x1 bricks with holes on the side are the older style
> with square holes, not the currently bricks with round holes. They're
> used as windows in the back tower, and look much better in this usage
> than the ones with round holes would have.
A lot of AFOLs confuse this classic window (1x1x1) with the 1x1x1 brick with
the holes on the side. This is a window, and was produced from 1957 to about
1981 (the yellow castle is possibly the last set that had these). When
classic LEGO windows started to be produced without the protruding window
sill (sometimes around 1970), some of the smallest of these windows stopped
having glass. The 1x1x2 and 1x2x1 windows call be found with or without
glass from this sill-less period of the 1970's. The 1x1x1 window, on the
otherhand, was always without glass during this period.
>
> > The switch from Type 1 to Type 2 (remember Type 1 were the cylinders
> > without the tapered base, and without the hole on top) took place in the
> > mid to late 1960's. I have a 1966 set 325 (Shell Station), and it came
> > with the Type 2 cylinders, but I would have thought that the switch
> > happened a little later. Anyone who has a bunch of Type 1 bricks will
> > remember them as not stacking together very securely.
>
> Aha, yes. That explains these other cylinders. Interesting. Thanks
> for the info. (Bizarrely enough I remember playing with these as
> a really young child and chewing on them, and I distinctly recall
> the amount of biting effort it took to pop apart type 2 cylinders,
> while the type 1s almost fell apart... strange thing to remember.)
>
> Where do the names - Type 1, 2, 3 - come from? TLC, or from the
> fan base?
>
> -r'm
I coined the phrase Type 1, 2, 3, for some of these LEGO bricks, etc., when I
started the "History Of LEGO Part 1..." series in 1998. This was for lack
of a better way to explain them.
Gary Istok
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Remy Evard <evard@mcs.anl.gov> wrote in message
news:8EB8E1D63evardmcsanlgov@lugnet.com...
> gistok@umich.edu (Gary Istok) wrote in <387B5239.D3AADAD3@umich.edu>:
> <snip>
> > The date they switched from the Type 2 cylinders (without hole) to Type
> > 3 was circa 1980. Someone with an intact Yellow Castle should check the
> > yellow cylinders to see if they have the holes or not.
>
> Just popped the tower open on mine to check - they're solid. Type 2s.
This intrigued me so I went and checked mine out too. Mine are definitely
type 3. This is not so surprising, since this set was released around
the time of the transition from type 2 to type 3 (it was released in 1978
in Europe, but not until 1980 in the US). So it seems that some versions
of the set had type 2 cylinders, and some had type 3.
In my estimation, the first set to include the type 3 cylinders would be
set 374 Fire Station from 1978. I don't have this set, but it clearly
comes with trans-blue cylinders, and I'm pretty certain that those (and the
other colored transparent cylinders) were only released as type 3. TLC
probably phased cylinders in existing colors to type 3 over a period of a
couple years.
Incidentally, the minifig was first released in 1978, not 1977 as I stated
in my previous post. The lugnet DB lists some early town sets with minifigs
as 1977 sets, but all other media suggests that they are actually 1978 sets.
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In lugnet.general, Mark Koesel writes:
>
> In my estimation, the first set to include the type 3 cylinders would be
> set 374 Fire Station from 1978. I don't have this set, but it clearly
> comes with trans-blue cylinders, and I'm pretty certain that those (and the
> other colored transparent cylinders) were only released as type 3. TLC
> probably phased cylinders in existing colors to type 3 over a period of a
> couple years.
Whereas my 590 has solid studs. I got this set from a yard sale in the mid
'80s. The only cylinders in the box were two yellow ones, all thee rest were
missing.
>
> Incidentally, the minifig was first released in 1978, not 1977 as I stated
> in my previous post. The lugnet DB lists some early town sets with minifigs
> as 1977 sets, but all other media suggests that they are actually 1978 sets.
590 was a 1977 set, and it has minifigs.
Jeff
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Jeff Stembel <aulddragon@wamalug.org> wrote in message
news:Fo8C7x.71s@lugnet.com...
> In lugnet.general, Mark Koesel writes:
> >
> > In my estimation, the first set to include the type 3 cylinders would be
> > set 374 Fire Station from 1978. I don't have this set, but it clearly
> > comes with trans-blue cylinders, and I'm pretty certain that those (and • the
> > other colored transparent cylinders) were only released as type 3. TLC
> > probably phased cylinders in existing colors to type 3 over a period of a
> > couple years.
>
> Whereas my 590 has solid studs. I got this set from a yard sale in the • mid
> '80s. The only cylinders in the box were two yellow ones, all thee rest • were
> missing.
Aha, of course -- set 590 Engine Co. No. 9. I actually have (or had --
can't
remember if I sold that one or not) that set too. Yes, this set is
identical
to set 374, but is in a different color scheme. I can say with certainty
that my copy of this set contained Type 3 trans blue cylinders. I can't
recall what color the yellow ones were, but I wouldn't be surprised at all
if those were still the Type 2 variety.
Technically then, I guess this set (590) ties with set 374 as the first set
to
use Type 3 cylinders. I'm sure there are others too -- like set 575
(another
1978 US only set) and many small sets.
> > Incidentally, the minifig was first released in 1978, not 1977 as I • stated
> > in my previous post. The lugnet DB lists some early town sets with • minifigs
> > as 1977 sets, but all other media suggests that they are actually 1978 • sets.
>
> 590 was a 1977 set, and it has minifigs.
LUGNET lists it as a 1977 set, yes. All information I have seen suggests
that
this is actually incorrect. I think that some sets on LUGNET use the
copyright
date information from the instructions or box as the set's release date.
This
information sometimes differs from actually "release year". Check out:
http://www.brickshelf.com/scans/catalogs/1978/c78us/c78us-13.html
Which clearly states that this set is new for 1978. That is, new for the
US.
I can't find this set in a catalog from any other region. I believe it was
a US only set, and thus there is no possibility that it was released in
another country a year earlier (but I could be wrong about that).
Also, check out:
http://www.brickshelf.com/scans/catalogs/1978/c78nl/index.html
This catalog from the netherlands shows many sets from 1978 with minifigs
in them. Every single one is labeled "new". Conclusion: the minifig was
released in 1978 (or to be specific: the 1978 Lego model year).
And if you are really curious about all this stuff (I find the history of
Lego quite fascinating myself :), check out Huw Millington's excellent (but
not quite complete) 1970's Lego Guide.
http://web.pncl.co.uk/~huw/lego/reference/1970s/1970home.html
> Jeff
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Mark Koesel wrote:
> Aha, of course -- set 590 Engine Co. No. 9. I actually have (or had --
> can't
> remember if I sold that one or not) that set too.
I got that one, Mark. FYI!
Scott S.
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Mark Koesel wrote in message ...
> that my copy of this set contained Type 3 trans blue cylinders. I can't
> recall what color the yellow ones were, but I wouldn't be surprised at all
Why? Are you colored blind or somethin'? ;-)
--
Have fun!
John
The Legos you've been dreaming of...
http://www114.pair.com/ig88/lego
my weird Lego site:
http://www114.pair.com/ig88/
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In lugnet.general, Mark Koesel writes:
> In my estimation, the first set to include the type 3 cylinders would be
> set 374 Fire Station from 1978. I don't have this set, but it clearly
> comes with trans-blue cylinders, and I'm pretty certain that those (and the
> other colored transparent cylinders) were only released as type 3.
No, 673 Rally Repair Crew from 1978 comes with all solid-topped
cylinders, incl. trans-blue. (Also, the instructions for 374 show
solid-topped cylinders, but that may not mean anything).
Nice set; I remember the pleasant surprise of 1x3 clear bricks
(the last set I got with any but the current ltd. clear brick
selection), and the horror of a multi-plate sticker, which
I knew would get lost.
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G. Benedikt Rochow <rochogb@eng.auburn.removethis.edu> wrote in message
news:Fo8Jzu.7Jp@lugnet.com...
> In lugnet.general, Mark Koesel writes:
>
> > In my estimation, the first set to include the type 3 cylinders would be
> > set 374 Fire Station from 1978. I don't have this set, but it clearly
> > comes with trans-blue cylinders, and I'm pretty certain that those (and • the
> > other colored transparent cylinders) were only released as type 3.
>
> No, 673 Rally Repair Crew from 1978 comes with all solid-topped
> cylinders, incl. trans-blue.
Wow, now that is strange. When were the trans-blue cylindars introduced
then? I can't find any sets that came with these from before 1978, so my
conclusion would be that they were released 1978. But if this is true, then
I wonder why Lego would bother casting this brand new part as both Type 2
and Type 3?
Maybe the Type 3 cylinders weren't actually released until 1979? I know
that
my copy of set 590 had them, but perhaps it was not purchased in it's first
year of availability (which was 1978), and thus had the newer Type 3 parts?
In any case, I've never seen any colored transparent cylinder in Type 2.
They must be very rare, being that they were introduced so close to the
period or transition from Type 2 to Type 3. Anyone know of any pictures of
these on the net?
> (Also, the instructions for 374 show
> solid-topped cylinders, but that may not mean anything).
Yes, that is probably not a good indictor. I have a few instruction
booklets
that show the older version of a part, when the newer version actually came
in the set.
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Mark Koesel wrote in message ...
>
> Remy Evard <evard@mcs.anl.gov> wrote in message
> news:8EB8E1D63evardmcsanlgov@lugnet.com...
> > gistok@umich.edu (Gary Istok) wrote in <387B5239.D3AADAD3@umich.edu>:
> > <snip>
> > > The date they switched from the Type 2 cylinders (without hole) to Type
> > > 3 was circa 1980. Someone with an intact Yellow Castle should check the
> > > yellow cylinders to see if they have the holes or not.
> >
> > Just popped the tower open on mine to check - they're solid. Type 2s.
>
> This intrigued me so I went and checked mine out too. Mine are definitely
> type 3. This is not so surprising, since this set was released around
> the time of the transition from type 2 to type 3 (it was released in 1978
> in Europe, but not until 1980 in the US). So it seems that some versions
> of the set had type 2 cylinders, and some had type 3.
This question about cylinders got started over in .castle. All of my
Yellow Castles come with the type 2 cylinder (in yellow) whereas my 677/6077
Knight's Processions come with type 3 cylinders (in grey). Does anybody
have a 677/6077 to compare to? Is it possible it came with both types of
cylinder (in grey)? Moreover, can anyone confirm this? The box shows the
type 2 in grey, but none of the 677 sets I have came with the type 2
cylinder.
--
Have fun!
John
The Legos you've been dreaming of...
http://www114.pair.com/ig88/lego
my weird Lego site:
http://www114.pair.com/ig88/
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"John DiRienzo" <ig88888888@stlnet.com> wrote in message
news:Fo8M8y.95u@lugnet.com...
> This question about cylinders got started over in .castle. All of my
> Yellow Castles come with the type 2 cylinder (in yellow) whereas my • 677/6077
> Knight's Processions come with type 3 cylinders (in grey). Does anybody
> have a 677/6077 to compare to?
My 6077 has Type 3 cylinders (one in grey, one in yellow).
> Is it possible it came with both types of cylinder (in grey)?
Yes. This would be the same case as with the 6075 (375) Castle. My copy
has Type 3 cylinders, yours (and others) have Type 2.
> Moreover, can anyone confirm this? The box shows the
> type 2 in grey, but none of the 677 sets I have came with the type 2
> cylinder.
It is possible that there were very few sold with the type 2 cylinders.
This set was available from 1979 to 1983, so it's likely that most of
the sets (perhaps all, I suppose) came with the Type 3 cylinders.
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Mark Koesel wrote in message ...
> "John DiRienzo" <ig88888888@stlnet.com> wrote in message
> news:Fo8M8y.95u@lugnet.com...
> > This question about cylinders got started over in .castle. All of my
> > Yellow Castles come with the type 2 cylinder (in yellow) whereas my • 677/6077
> > Knight's Processions come with type 3 cylinders (in grey). Does anybody
> > have a 677/6077 to compare to?
>
> My 6077 has Type 3 cylinders (one in grey, one in yellow).
>
> > Is it possible it came with both types of cylinder (in grey)?
>
> Yes. This would be the same case as with the 6075 (375) Castle. My copy
> has Type 3 cylinders, yours (and others) have Type 2.
>
> > Moreover, can anyone confirm this? The box shows the
> > type 2 in grey, but none of the 677 sets I have came with the type 2
> > cylinder.
>
> It is possible that there were very few sold with the type 2 cylinders.
> This set was available from 1979 to 1983, so it's likely that most of
> the sets (perhaps all, I suppose) came with the Type 3 cylinders.
Elsewhere on Lugnet recently, there was some talk about Lego copyrighting
their models (and stickers, see the new Arctic stickers copyright date) a
couple years in advance of releasing them. It is possible, I guess, if
things are the same now as they were twenty years ago, that they made the
box art, instructions and catalog pictures well in advance, while the type 2
cylinders were common, but did not actually release the sets with the type 2
cylinders. I guess we can't be positive, but I have never had a 677/6077
with type 2 cylinders (and I have had a lot of this set, at least ten
copies, probably not all from USA or Canada). Seeing that this set was
released much earlier in Europe, I would guess (again) if any of the
677/6077s included the type 2 cylinders, they would be European sets
--
Have fun!
John
The Legos you've been dreaming of...
http://www114.pair.com/ig88/lego
my weird Lego site:
http://www114.pair.com/ig88/
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ig88888888@stlnet.com (John DiRienzo) wrote in <Fo8M8y.95u@lugnet.com>:
> This question about cylinders got started over in .castle. All of my
> Yellow Castles come with the type 2 cylinder (in yellow) whereas my • 677/6077
> Knight's Processions come with type 3 cylinders (in grey). Does anybody
> have a 677/6077 to compare to? Is it possible it came with both types of
> cylinder (in grey)? Moreover, can anyone confirm this? The box shows the
> type 2 in grey, but none of the 677 sets I have came with the type 2
> cylinder.
Hmmmm. Check these out:
6077 - The US release:
http://www.lugnet.com/pause/search/?query=6077-1
The picture clearly shows a type 3 grey cylinder.
677 - The European version:
http://www.lugnet.com/pause/search/?query=677
Inconclusive, but different picture.
But:
http://www.brickshelf.com/scans/0000/0677/0677-01.html
The photograph in the european building instructions
clearly shows a type 2 grey cylinder.
And:
http://www.brickshelf.com/scans/catalogs/1979/c79de/c79de-15.html
The 1979 German catalog also shows type 2s.
I'm thinking this is the confirmation we're looking for.
I have 677, and it's currently built from type 2s because that's what
my instructions showe... but that means nothing, as those pieces have
been mixed in with my parts collection for 20 years.
My yellow castle, on the other hand, has never gotten mixed in, and
as I said somewhere near the beginning of this thread, it has type 2s.
But I should note I got it in Europe - that may be a distinguinshing
factor.
-r'm
Remy Evard, Argonne National Laboratory
http://www.mcs.anl.gov/~evard - Sorry, no Lego pages up yet
Supercomputing and systems administration by day, AFOL by late night
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You've actually left out a type of "classic" window--the 1x2x2 train windows
that were available in just a few sets in the mid-70's (137, 164, 182, and
727). These aren't "classic" windows in the sense that they have the same type
of frame-and-glass construction as the others (they're just printed 1x2x2 clear
bricks), but I think they should be added to your history. Here's a close-up
shot of some of the windows:
http://www.lightlink.com/demlow/pics/eisenbahnfenster.jpg
Alan
In lugnet.general, Gary R. Istok writes:
> When I get some time, I want to generate an entirely new HISTORY OF LEGO
> WINDOWS document. But in the mean time, here are some brief
> updates......
>
> Gary Istok
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> LEGEND
>
> CA= Cellulose Acetate - plastic used for windows from 1957-63.
>
> ABS = Plastic used for windows from 1963-present.
>
> Sills = The window sill underneath the window protrudes forward on all
> early LEGO windows (except for the 1x6x3 picture window and the classic
> door). Later, circa 1970 the sill was recessed so that it was nearly
> flush with the surface of the window frame.
>
> The 214 numbering system used for these windows matches the parts pack
> numbers used from 1957-66. This also coincided with the numbers used
> for European Dealer Windows & Door Boxes (214 1-10), where pieces were
> sold individually from 1957 until the latter 1960's.
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> 214/1 (1x6x3 Large Window) - This window is available in CA in red or
> white, and in ABS in red, white and yellow*.
>
> 214/2 (1x6x2 Large Window) - This window is available in CA (with sill
> only) in red or white, and in ABS (with or without sill) in red and
> white..
>
> 214/3 (1x6x2 shuttered window) - This window is available in CA (with
> sill only) in red or white, and in ABS (with or without sill) in red and
> white.
>
> 214/4 (1x4x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> in red or white, and in ABS (with or without sill) in red and white.
>
> 214/5 (1x3x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red and white, and ABS (without
> sill) in red, white and blue**.
>
> 214/6 (1x2x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red, white and yellow***, and ABS
> (without sill) in red, white, yellow, blue, black## and grey**.
> Currently still in production in red, white, yellow, blue.
>
> 214/7 (1x1x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red and white, and ABS (without
> sill) in red, white, yellow##, or black##.
>
> 214/8 (1x2x1 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red, white and yellow***, and ABS
> (without sill) in red, white and yellow##.
>
> 214/9 (1x1x1 window) - This window is available in CA (without sill
> only) in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red and white, and ABS
> (without sill) in red, white and yellow##.
>
> 214/10 (1x2x3 door) - The classic door is available in CA in red or
> white, and in ABS in red, white and yellow#. The right handed and left
> handed doors are available for all colors and plastics.
>
> * Available in Shell sets 325 and 648.
> ** Available in 80's train set.
> *** Only available in Shell set 325.
> # Available in many 60's - 70's sets.
> ## Available in 70's train sets.
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Well, maybe, maybe not. :-) It is one of those gray areas. Do I include car windows?
Such as the 2x4x1.666 (the 1 brick and 2 plates high) double sided car windshields from
the 70's? And then there's the clear bricks used as windows in the #310 Esso Service
Station. And then there are the minifig stiff era doors that are 1x3x4 (from the 70's).
I agree that there are more than the original 10 windows/doors, but that will probably be
a separate topic.
Gary Istok
Alan Demlow wrote:
> You've actually left out a type of "classic" window--the 1x2x2 train windows
> that were available in just a few sets in the mid-70's (137, 164, 182, and
> 727). These aren't "classic" windows in the sense that they have the same type
> of frame-and-glass construction as the others (they're just printed 1x2x2 clear
> bricks), but I think they should be added to your history. Here's a close-up
> shot of some of the windows:
>
> http://www.lightlink.com/demlow/pics/eisenbahnfenster.jpg
>
> Alan
>
> In lugnet.general, Gary R. Istok writes:
> > When I get some time, I want to generate an entirely new HISTORY OF LEGO
> > WINDOWS document. But in the mean time, here are some brief
> > updates......
> >
> > Gary Istok
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > LEGEND
> >
> > CA= Cellulose Acetate - plastic used for windows from 1957-63.
> >
> > ABS = Plastic used for windows from 1963-present.
> >
> > Sills = The window sill underneath the window protrudes forward on all
> > early LEGO windows (except for the 1x6x3 picture window and the classic
> > door). Later, circa 1970 the sill was recessed so that it was nearly
> > flush with the surface of the window frame.
> >
> > The 214 numbering system used for these windows matches the parts pack
> > numbers used from 1957-66. This also coincided with the numbers used
> > for European Dealer Windows & Door Boxes (214 1-10), where pieces were
> > sold individually from 1957 until the latter 1960's.
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > 214/1 (1x6x3 Large Window) - This window is available in CA in red or
> > white, and in ABS in red, white and yellow*.
> >
> > 214/2 (1x6x2 Large Window) - This window is available in CA (with sill
> > only) in red or white, and in ABS (with or without sill) in red and
> > white..
> >
> > 214/3 (1x6x2 shuttered window) - This window is available in CA (with
> > sill only) in red or white, and in ABS (with or without sill) in red and
> > white.
> >
> > 214/4 (1x4x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> > in red or white, and in ABS (with or without sill) in red and white.
> >
> > 214/5 (1x3x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> > in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red and white, and ABS (without
> > sill) in red, white and blue**.
> >
> > 214/6 (1x2x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> > in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red, white and yellow***, and ABS
> > (without sill) in red, white, yellow, blue, black## and grey**.
> > Currently still in production in red, white, yellow, blue.
> >
> > 214/7 (1x1x2 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> > in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red and white, and ABS (without
> > sill) in red, white, yellow##, or black##.
> >
> > 214/8 (1x2x1 window) - This window is available in CA (with sill only)
> > in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red, white and yellow***, and ABS
> > (without sill) in red, white and yellow##.
> >
> > 214/9 (1x1x1 window) - This window is available in CA (without sill
> > only) in red or white, in ABS (with sill) in red and white, and ABS
> > (without sill) in red, white and yellow##.
> >
> > 214/10 (1x2x3 door) - The classic door is available in CA in red or
> > white, and in ABS in red, white and yellow#. The right handed and left
> > handed doors are available for all colors and plastics.
> >
> > * Available in Shell sets 325 and 648.
> > ** Available in 80's train set.
> > *** Only available in Shell set 325.
> > # Available in many 60's - 70's sets.
> > ## Available in 70's train sets.
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